140303 My G+ Commentsss..., on Ukraine
+Alan Bell Yep! Cooperate, is the way.
However, it goes directly against the western 'capitalist' ideology,
of 'competition', which does translate from the market place into the
ridiculous political arenas all over the globe.
As for your "Ukraine is
broken,..." is it not obvious, ALL 'modern' so-called
'democratic' nations and regions are 'broken'.
"Everyone lives in a failed state,
mate!
In every nation on Earth!
Everyone lives in a failed state, mate!
Makes you wonder what a bloke's votes
worth?"
as the song went.
I see the overall problem is that
private, corporations, as gaining power, creep into government
arenas, so corrupting the original concept.
That's an age old 'creeping', such that
we misinterpret the whole field of mass people management
['GOVERNMENT'], now, as to be more a private corporate affair.
It IS NOT!
[But HEY? 'Government' was once
monarchic? We have to look back to the fabled 'Garden of Eden' type
scenes, [aka, pre-colonial Australia, perhaps?], to find True
Democratic government.]
The issue is much much larger than the
Ukraine, Crimea, or even of these overt and covert, disputes between
two superpowers.
The issue, as I see it, is merely the
business of re-distinguishing between the Proper roles of 'Capital',
as per capitalism, and of 'Government', as per the most safe,
intelligent, efficient management of the mass of [crazy mad]
individuals.
'Capitalism' rightly allowed to
function, includes the free consumer market, commodities etc, and
that's all.
It's alleged antipathy - 'socialism',
does not want, and has nothing to do with the free market place, or
the production and distribution of 'capital'. 'Socialism' is merely
the most efficient system of mass people management, structured so
capital and capitalism, can move, be created, and distributed most
efficiently.
The two need not be entwined at all,
almost.
But this is, as said, an issue well
beneath, and much much larger than the current discord in the
Ukraine.
Nevertheless, I maintain, that until we
ALL learn the differences between the role/s market and it's basic
reason - capital - and the role of Socialist government, these types
of fabricated disputes will keep being invented.
And, according to some, this, the
Ukraine dispute/s, like Libya, Egypt, Syria, et al, are all
fabrications of a dogged US administration, much larger than the
White House, which has the long term agenda, of breaking up all the
'old money' states, where puppet rulers have been installed by the
19th, early 20th century Brit-Euro colonialists, the old rule
monarchists. And all within seriously 'malfunctioning' borders, and
the ensuing administrations. [The USA, too!]
According to an article on the Voice of
Russia, the US admin, plans, and wants Russia to be broken into some
60-plus 'Democratic' states.
I cannot disagree with that ideal,
while me, pro-Russia, and Socialism, but one must ask whether the
[violent] means justifies the end.
And, whether at this 'juncture' the end
is ever gonna be attainable, before say, a nuclear outbreak of war
starts and stops everything, or before the rest of the planet's
ecosystem/s, and any remaining civil order and control/s collapse/s?
Nothing of that offers immediate
alternatives to the current crises in the Ukraine, but it does add
considerably to what we should all be conscious of, and thinking
about while we seek immediate effective resolutions to the Ukraine
bullshit.
These conflicts for the most part,
arise out of ignorance of the Proper roles, of, capital, capitalism,
and government, the most efficient, and social way to let people
live. And of course, these conflicts arise as well, because of
fucking psychopaths in power, who've simply long ago lost the plot!
MORE!
I agree, Ken, for what it's worth.
The US has been continually assaulted,
in every possible way, by the 'monarchist' Brit-Euro cabals, since
well before 1776, and it has really not, nor ever, gained the fabled
"Democratic Republic's independence".
There are 'honchos' high-up in the US
[most of whom I think of as pretty vicious and psychotic, to varying
degrees, (Hi Dick! Rummie!)] who know that too much of the world is
owned and controlled by selfish monarchic regimes, regimes and
dynasties who will never and cannot break their addiction to the
wealth they've gained over say, 500 years of colonial expansionism/s.
Wealth gained, as we know, at the
terrible expense of the vast majority of once, peaceful, agrarian
Peoples, Indigenies.
So sound logic, intelligent
decision-making or not, the US elites, some of them who have taken up
the fight against that [necessarily ever-expanding] colonial
monarchism, see, and possibly correctly, that if the 'monarchic
regime - global' - is allowed to stay where it is, the world will
implode, ecologically, and 'politico-economically', and for our own
Integrity, People will just keep and increase their resistance to
centrist totalitarianist control.
Large states, like large 'empires', are
well passed their use-by and functional, sustainable 'date'.
I'd posit that Putin and his admin.,
recognize this too. But he's close to the Chinese hegemony, and
other 'socialist' state leaderships. They probably can
intellectualize the rectitude of possibly thousands of smaller,
locally governed more properly "Democratic" [micro-]states
worldwide.
But bringing the whole of us
up-to-speed on Proper Government, allowing 'Capital' to do it's
thing, best with minimal government interference, and taking into
consideration the several other entities, like fanatical and severe
religions, and crazy mad right wing groups, etc., means we've all
some way to go before that knowledge-base-global of how best to have
capital and socialist government coexist, is worldwide.
Were the Chinese and 'socialist' groups
and powers to acquiesce to the western putsch now, into the Ukraine,
things might get a lot worse. So both sides have to maintain some
semblance of disagreement, hoping things will settle themselves,
hoping also that knowledge will keep spreading into all the little
firey corners, and one day, one luvly magical morning "we'll all
wake up to Paradise".
In short, Realists, don't hold much
hope at all, long term, but also regard the Fight for Integrity in
all things, is better than lying down to stupidity and ignorance of
over-consuming fuck everything cultural rubbish.
But what would I know?
MORE..., from me
+David Fillingham
1, "Perhaps we should give it to
Israel, and settle the matter for good!"
yeah! Sure....! hohoho...
2, "...
+John Doe If that were accomplished by
legitimate democratic means, absent the threat of force, based on the
decisions of the Ukrainian people - sure."
Sorry but? What stops smart guys like
you, and most commenters here, from admitting, that 'Democracy' in
any Realistic structure, just isn't extant. Not in the Ukraine, the
EU, Russia [of course] nor the US-marketed west? "CHINA' fuck's
sake, is more 'democratic' than the rest of us! [Well....?]
Any 'democracy', is for the elite few,
less than in Plato's ancient Greece.
My 2 bob's worth, is, Ukraine, being in
the middle, of 'east and west', is more important to the larger issue
of 'ideological divides', and the sustainability of either.
I go with 'eastern Ukraine' siding
with, becoming a micro-state, 'colony' as Ukraine was before, of
Russia, and the west can go west, albeit a bad decision, fueled by
absolutely false marketing of the capitalist west.
But as the CNN maps show, the spread of
language, thus culture, thus preferences is too wide to section-off
east from west, etc, and/or Crimea and the south.
I doubt this fracas is going to be
short term. And, we don't know what's really being discussed behind
closed doors, re US, EU and Russia, et al?
Britain, going by Hague's performances,
is but trying to be seen to be someone useful, while they also,
really do not have any cause to be involved.
"Must give the troops something to
do, what!? (When's the next election??)"
If it doesn't get resolved in the short
term, and becomes a football, we can only hope the powers use
Ukraine's peculiar geopolitical location, to nut out deeper, far far
longer term global decisions.
I see that as addressing 'borders',
thus, 'nations' as we've been drawn into seeing and foolishly
accepting them by the 200 years of British and Eurapean 'resources
and land-grabbing colonialism.
[That, is what is behind the current
'austerity' and failing financials across the Brit-Euro countries -
they have no more OTHER PEOPLES' land to plunder. That should be
clear to everyone.]
The Ukraine suffers now, for that same
conquer-mindset, of both key ideological players, and the setting up
of inappropriate, unsuitable, unsustainable borders.
It's one of those HUGE issues, most
average and even politically-interested Joes' can't wrap their
thoughts around.
Many political academics are fully
aware of this being beneath so many 'localized' civil and regional
wars - the Middle-East' very much so.
The Ukraine, I reckon, no different.
That it's where it is, should be seen
by everyone, [unlikely by the egomaniacs in pro-EU right wing
Ukrainian powerhouses now though], as using this to dig into and
resolve on the broader front.
War talk is posturing, for the
pharmaceutical corps to sell more prozac type pills.... [hohoho].
Azaman
DiasYesterday 5:47 PM
There is one
thing, which twists the entire situation and the role of Russia in
it. Let's make it clear: Russia DOES NOT annex any territory and DOES
NOT support any side of the INTERNAL political conflict in Ukraine!
Russian forces PROTECT CIVILIANS of all the etnicities, Ukrainians,
Tatars, Russians, Jews, etc. from the nazi guerillas, that now, after
the Ukrainian legal power's collapse, terrorise the ENTIRE Ukraine.
On Mar. 2 the
'Left Sector', leading nazi militia, and 'Avtomaidan' 'activists'
arrived in Odessa (see map), killed one and injured some (no valid
report available for now), blocated the local administration
buildings and performed the actions, that can be treated as robbery
against the local civilians. There was no resistance as the local
police is completely disorganised and the self-protection forces were
not ready yet.
Such a situation
is impossible, e.g. in Crimea, where the situation is under control
of the local authorities, who have the complete support, including
the armed forces, of the Russian navy base personnel, welcomed by the
citizens, no matter of what etnicity they are. This also affects the
local political life in a positive manner as the people, except the
nazi of any kind, feel safe to discuss the political issues and to
perform the activities of any kind in the legal field.So, for now the
Crimea peninsula is the most peaceful and safe region of the Ukraine.
Regarding all
that, the current western position on the topic seems to be a pure
example of the complete hypocrisy.
Max CookYesterday 8:33 PM
+Azaman Dias Thanks for your insights.
It indicates, local protective troupes
will form, and should [the world's youth are not softcocks like the
generations of the last 50 years], merely, initially to secure their
local areas, east of Odessa with a Russian leaning.
But the back row [pro-Euro] agitators
will pay and push the 'nazi' mobs to keep pushing, the ideological
war, we can expect, as far as they can, even to provoke, rather
stupidly, the Russian military to strike back.
But it's clear [to me, anyway], any
Russian 'wall' of arms, say, will be merely to assert a line in the
sand, behind which the pro-Russian population/s will be safe.
Whatever, the west, via the thug
mercenaries, seems to want, like rapacious maniac robots, to keep
trying to shatter any Russian stability, to send the Ukraine into
breakdown mode.
Then, while we can be sure the
secretive subversives and financiers aka the CIA in Libya, will
orchestrate ongoing chaos, breakdown of all order, until, it's "Syria
part two", with all manner of external warmongering moving in,
and not all 'balanced' ideological nutters in for the BANGBANGS.
All, backed by O! Korngold AGAIN!
Israel's weapons-dealers, ET cetera.
Unless..., well before Putin is on the
back foot, someone brings up the larger issue/s of 'national borders'
and the whole flawed 19th century structure of nations across that
region, and beyond, and it's glued to the top and centre of the table
over which they all negotiate, and talk the shit they do?
NOT optimisitic.
Alexey SemenovYesterday 11:53 PM+1
"then we might be able to convince
Putin that his long-term strategic interests lay in taking Crimea and
leaving the rest of Ukraine alone." - ахаххаххаа )))
ххаха )))
I read your comments and I want to give
you a view of Russia . That you have at least some idea of what
is happening.
The U.S. and Europe are trying to make
a hot spot in the Ukraine in order to weaken Russia and Ukraine. At
the same time the U.S. is trying to weaken and Europe. American
politicians do not hesitate to talk about it. The Ukraine was paid
revolution and its done . Now, however, there is no government . U.S.
and Europe are not able to govern Ukraine .
Russia is doing now? The only thing
that we did - put the strengthened protection of its military base in
Ukraine. That's all. The rest of the panic and hysteria of Europeans
Americans is an empty sound reminiscent of farting or belching .
Russia does nothing else ! Absolutely nothing.
We still have the old plans and
projects that were developed a few years ago . One of the projects -
to build a bridge from Russia to the Crimea .
We have a direct appeal of the
President of Ukraine - Viktor Yanukovych to Russia " by any
means to prevent bloodshed in Ukraine." So we have the same
appeal of the President of Crimea ( Crimea is an autonomous republic
of Ukraine and Crimea is not subject to Kiev ) . Crimea sought
protection from Russia . Since 60% of the Crimea Russian , the
Crimea will receive this protection , if necessary . I say again ,
for very unwise - Russia does not introduce troops to Ukraine !
As for news on your channel - you write
- " Russia wants to start a war with Ukraine " is the most
awful nonsense that I have heard. In Ukraine, there is no army ! In
Ukraine, there is a small group of Nazis, who seized power thanks to
the sponsors - the U.S., Poland and other euro - gay country. If the
people of Ukraine in a referendum vote for Russia to remove these
forces out of the country - Russian troops enter and clean the virus
from Ukraine .
Russia is not going to annex the
territory of Ukraine. If any parts of Ukraine want it , they can do
it by legal means - a popular referendum .
All that has made the United States and
Europe shows full of irresponsibility, incompetence and inhumanity of
American and Euro- gay politicians. You can not just pick up and set
on the country the Nazis.
Latest news from London - British media
finally , after a month , noticed Nazi symbols on flags Maidan ! !
Yes, not really something ! ? I say this is a very long time ! !
I want to remind you about another
fact: the whole revolution in the Ukraine took place exactly on
American textbooks ! These sama textbooks were used for the
revolution in Egypt and Yugoslavia (at least) and perhaps in other
countries. U.S. leads constantly dirty politics worldwide. And God
knows , sooner or later , the U.S. will trigger a nuclear war .
MORE me...;
+David Fillingham Yeah, so he isn't up
with the new name - FSB?
Also, your references to WWs 1 & 2,
accurate as records go, misses the back room ideological battles
waged to set up both wars, for totally unpublicized reasons - Israel,
a homeland for the jews.
19th century most wealthy Brit-Euro
elites - all with links to age-old dynasties, arranging things to
secure their lineages into the unforeseeable future.
Hitler, but a puppet, as were most
'players' of the last 100 years.
Sadly, the facts behind what we've all
come to accept, are so contrary to them, for the vast majority, it's
one of those 'too hard to absorb assimilate' and correct in our
thinking of 'history'.
Thus, it's all too hard for everyone to
come to believe.
But 'believe' they must, if
we-collective, are to get a more accurate understanding of 19th, 20th
and 21st C 'history' thus the ability to know WHAT we are voting for
in these sham 'democratic elections' etc.
As well..., it's all too hard for
everyone to come to believe, if only for the pressure from 'vested
interests' such as the major cults - Theosophical Society [the 'TS'],
formed in the wealth and influences and 19thC magic cabals of Helene
Blavatsky, Cecil Rhodes, Ed Bulwer-Lytton [an English aristocrat
relative/ancestor of mine], Alice Bailey, et al et al, and the
'genesis' of most 'secret societies' since then - Golden Dawn of
Alistair Crowley, and, the spy agencies of today.
These 'secret societies' and spy
agencies, 'lost the plot' of intelligent, rational, balanced
discernment of the issues of war - distribution of resources, almost
as soon as they started forming 'secret societies' all because they
were 'chosen by god, et al' to rearrange the world, to be more [of
their western already long-lost tribes' elite ] way/s.
[That's a big reason why, we laugh at
the terms 'military intelligence', or 'police intelligence' etc,
because they're trying to be 'intelligent' that-is deducing facts,
evidence, courses of events, by 'wizardry, 'divining' etc, which is
the exact counter to genuine application of the innate intellect of
the higher mind. At least, they were misusing these faculties. Now,
there is a more correct, proper use, so they are finally able to
'divine' passed facts and events as they were, without the
'imagination' messing things up.]
That side is avoided like the plague by
most everyone, because those dogs in those still extant 'secret
societies' are filthy with fanaticism and dedication to their
'masters' aka the masons and Rome, [both essentially subservient to
the TS] and the numerous other 'ss's', and to speak out with the
historical facts about them, incurs their [inflated]
evil/demonic/mad-as-bags-of-rabies occult energies, with the added
abilities to kill all chances of employment, to kill all your 'social
circles' including families, sworn to secrecy, and to fuck you UP.
aka, me homeless for 19 years!
So, referring to WW1 & 2, has good
value, but it still has to get beneath the elite's attempts at
controlling things, both then, and now, as in how they change history
to suit their pride, basically.
It goes on and on and on and on and,
still we find things often do not, can not add up, to show us any
clear unambiguous telling, retelling of history, thus, of what and
why it's going off in places like Syria, and Ukraine.
Notice, how there's next to nothing on
media about 'Syria' since the Ukraine crisis was focused in on by the
MSM?
The Ukraine, while a real event, albeit
'fabricated by western anti-Russia powers, and while it's locale,
thus 'politik', is more important to the bigger world dispute between
the two major ideologies -crapitalism v socialism, is but another
'circuit-breaker' so Syria can take a breath. Etc!
And there's more complications behind
both 'crises', we really can't be bothered nutting through, which are
entwined, and involve the planet's long term 'hopes'.
So, from me, I'd suggest no-one gets
too panicked by Ukraine, or Syria, disgustingly bad as Syria's death
toll/s are, [ but what do we care NOW, about the tolls of every war
of the last 6 decades? Only the jews have made a fortune from their
alleged holocaust by the alleged anti-Semite Hitler, etc etc etc?].
Keep watching, thinking and commenting
about any shitfight that occurs, but in the end, the elites are too
far into their mad plans for us, that they're gonna push on
regardless.
You must see that in how the majors'
foreign ministers et al, ponse around on camera, and the rest of the
diplomat corps strut like gods.
It's their game, as far as they're
concerned, and they have exclusive control of the ball, the
boundaries, the umpires, the teams and the sports media.
140223 My & Others' Guardian
Ukraine Crisis Comments
Yulia Tymoshenko
addresses crowd in Kiev after release from prison, as MPs vote to
impeach Viktor Yanukovych
Shaun Walker in
Kiev
The Observer,
Saturday 22 February 2014 16.37 EST
Sounds like Syria, Libya, Egypt,
Yugoslavia,The Czech Republic, and a host of other countries who've
been through these right wing, western-fabricated, fueled and
sponsored revolts.
Not saying some 'corrections' to
'socialist' rule didn't need to happen. But most of them went bad
for bad advisers, and western pressure from within.
Much of the world is chaotic,
politically, now.
Perfect for the flailing and failing
[zionist monarchic] elites to worm further disruption in,
'justifying' [NOT!] imposing heavier authoritarianism, no different
at all to the worst 'soviet' totalitarianism.
Large political protests today are all
quickly taken over by powerful subversives, mostly of a
far-right-wing, capitalist leaning.
Most of them are not nearly as
intelligent as is needed for good government, and are but paid thugs,
to disrupt democracy in the favor of the corporate elites. The
zionist monarchies, eventually.
Timoshenko, will now ride the revolt
and introduction of Eurapean capitalism into the Ukraine, and as
likely will end assassinated, once enough Ukrainians realize that
Eurape is not any friend, but is capitalism gone utterly and
irreparably crazy.
Eurape's best product: advertising &
marketing.
traktorist
23 February 2014
6:46am
Recommend
28
I'm a Ukrainian
who has lived most of his adult life in the West; I am also gay; and
I would like Ukraine to be a part of EU eventually. So you'd think I
should be happy after the victory of this supposedly "pro-western",
"pro-european" revolution. But I don't see any reason.
As a result of
this revolution, we are likely to end up with good ol' Tymoshenko,
who has been in big politics for more than a decade – in the role
of the Prime Minister twice already, as well as the Minister of Fuel
and Energy – and proved to be every bit as corrupt as Yanukovych.
She uses the same rhetoric as after the Orange Revolution saying that
the country has now "changed forever". Indeed, now the
nationalist movement has risen to unprecedented levels both in
western and eastern parts of Ukraine and is at the risk of becoming
very radical. I don't really notice any other differences.
I am also
extremely disappointed with how Western media reported about these
events in Ukraine. Tell me if I'm wrong, but I could only see BBC to
make an effort to actually send their reporters to Eastern Ukraine
and talk to locals there. It is usually portrayed that Maidan
represents the people of Ukraine, the majority, but is there a poll
supporting that? When it was reported that the protests were
supported in other cities around Ukraine like Lviv, one could get an
impression that it is the second major city in Ukraine. However, it
should have been noted that while Lviv is the biggest city with
Ukrainian-speaking majority, it's not the second city by population,
nor the third... It's the seventh. Why didn't those reporters go to 5
cities that were larger than Lviv but had a different attitude? It's
also worth noting that out 27 regions of Ukraine, 7 regions of
South-East produce 45% of GDP and all of them are in the top 10 of
regional GDP after Kiev. If you look at GDP per capita, the last 11
regions at the bottom are in western Ukraine, Lviv region is at #13
out of 27. So, while people in this area are at the heart of
revolution for integration of Ukraine with EU, once there is an
opportunity for freedom of movement (which I believe is what many
aspire to), most likely they will be the first to leave Ukraine in
search for better opportunities in Western Europe. One should really
wonder just how much Maidan represents the majority of people in
Ukraine. It definitely reflects the mood in Lviv. That's also where
openly nationalist party "Svoboda" has 30-40% support. It
is beyond sad that Western media and leaders ignore this fact.
ID7509860 has already commented that jews are advised to leave
Ukraine. I'll add that 'Svoboda' has already proposed a "temporary"
ban on Russian films and TV in Ukraine. Meanwhile, Europe is mocking
Russian media for referring to protesters as a radical movement.
Probably radicals are not majority after all, and I don't want to
believe that such group will gain power in Ukraine, but there is
definitely potential for that, and the mere fact that a seemingly
progressive leader like Klitschko was collaborating with them is also
worrying. (BTW to appeal to them, he had to switch to talking in
Ukrainian, although his mother tongue is Russian, which would be
totally understood by anyone in Ukraine but is of course not welcome
by western Ukrainian nationalists.) These are not signs of liberal,
pro-European values to me, unless you talk of darker times in
European history.
To sum up, we're
at the brink of the worst economic crisis in years, which is sort of
nothing new to us, but such a polarized division between Ukrainian-
and Russian-speaking Ukrainians together with a strong nationalist
party in the Parliament is a new development.
KingCommo TO traktorist
23 February 2014 8:06am
Thanks for your views. I'm a fool in
Astrayliar, but watch this with half an interest, seeing it as more
crap from the west to totally smash socialism.
The Ukraine and Poland are in the midst
of two power-hungry ideologue administrations.
'Administrations', not 'nations'.
'Nations' everywhere, are a falsity,
invented to give people the feeling of 'belonging', but all along,
are just the empires of the elites, monarchies and sychophantic
'high-class servants' [the political class].
Poland involves itself on pressure and
advice from the mad-crapitalist, corporate Eurapeans.
But 'Poland' too, which media refers
to, is but the Polish aristocracy, as are the Ukrainian backers of
Tymoshenko.
Russia can not intervene now, simply
because the west has the world in it's media-thrall, and will be
demonised until the west justifies another major war between
super-states. Or up-scaling of tensions, for their own subversive
advantages, as in Syria, etc.
If, 'if', the Ukrainian People can rope
in this revolt, before it falls completely to overwhelming Eurapean
mass hysterical 'WE WON WE WON' bullshit, they have to address the
problems from an international perspective.
Primarily that 'nations' and false,
imposed borders are behind so many, if not all of the failures of the
whole notion of 'democracy'.
Because borders only really create
'economic exclusion zones' for the dynastic elites to manage, always
to their selfish advantage, and always, as we see everywhere the west
has colonized and carved up little colonies for themselves, [A! The
Middle-East, Africa, perhaps?] to the disastrous disadvantage of the
People.
Ukraine may well be crucial in solving
this worldwide problem, for being in the middle of the two
ideologies.
So, I'm suggesting for Ukraine to avoid
utter civil war, funded and supplied by the two opposing ideologies,
they have to appeal to the rest of us, but focusing directly on the
core source of the problem - false borders.
But, of course, we all have to take on
the dynastic monarchies, and call them out as being totally
anachronistic in the 21st century.
So too, their financiers, the western
religions.
A big and v hard call, no doubt.
vialactea
23 February 2014
6:49am
Recommend
15
Well, it appears
that removing legal and legitimised governments by rioting is the new
definition of Democracy being promoted by the US and the West. Free,
fair and universal elections is not a democratic tool to be used any
longer. Well done and see who's next....
KingCommo TO vialactea
23 February 2014 8:10am
Funny! Perhaps it'll become known as
"Demobracy"?
KingCommo TO vialactea
23 February 2014 8:14am
Only problem is, we've not seen 'free,
fair and universal elections' anywhere really. [Well..., almost!]
Because the wealthiest self-interested parties are best at conning
[bribing] the voters into voting in puppets.
But, that's life, when all wages and
salaries are bribes.
DrSigmundFraud
23 February 2014
5:55am
Recommend
6
Mrs Merkel said
without closer European integration there would be wars, refusing to
integrate into Europe sure did cause one in Ukraine.
Regardless of
anything else, the president by choosing not join Europe has has been
toppled the country is in flames and may break into separate states
as a country divides over its loyalties.
Europe is no
longer a choice and we have seen in the Ukraine that trying to choose
any different will end in disaster.
The Times
described Ukraine as Europe's first civil war like it or not the
issue of European membership dragged a country to war and deaths were
caused in a conflict inflamed not just by state authorities but left
and rightwing agitators serving their own agendas.
Just like in the
Second World War people are dying in the name name of a grand vision
of Europe that is not of most peoples choosing and most have had no
say in.
This is an issue
that democratic referendum should have solved before violence.
Why could the pro
and anti-European sides not have decided their countries future in a
referendum on European membership?
So what now?
Are countries
that want OUT of Europe justified in dragging their country to civil
war because they do not agree with their government decisions on
European membership?
Are they
justified in resorting to violence in the absence of a public
referendum they are demanding on an issue that refuses to vanish from
the fore font of British politics?
According to the
worlds reaction to the Ukraine YES.
The Ukraine like
the times is Europe's “first” civil war, meaning “first” as
in "not the last" and if this double edged sword begins to
swing backwards it could well be the fate of any country if not ours.
That may be a
wild prediction but Imagine if you will, in an upsurge of
anti-European sentiment although not giving UKIP power gives it
enough votes to hold back the Tories of handing Labour an easy
victory in 2015.
Ed Miliband
assimilates Britain into Europe in the great integration pact of 2017
without holding the referendum the public have been demanding, this
is his only “popular” act as he has failed to reverse the
cutbacks or improve Britain’s economic situation.
The ratings
agencies warnings of the dangers of a credit based recovery and
housing bubble have gone unheeded, rising house prices and record
levels of personal debt have caused another credit crunch wiping out
Britain’s fragile recovery and plunging the country back into
recession and rising levels of national debt.
Labour is forced
to abandon its election promises of a return to high levels of public
spending and instead is forced to continue the savage austerity
measures instigated by its predecessors leading to a mass sense of
public betrayal.
As anti-austerity
protests once again sweep the country in a wave of public anger
Russell Brand agitates an anti-establishment mob, that along side the
protestors take to the streets and begin demanding an end to a
government and political system that has failed to deliver the change
it promised.
Growing anger
among nationalists unhappy and angered by the new terms of Europe,
UKIPs failure and not having a voice on European membership
capitalise on the unrest and take to the streets to demand their
voice be heard and a immediate referendum on Europe be held.
In a flare up of
anti-establishment violence order breaks down and political violence
between left and right begins, adding to and inflaming the
confrontations as battling authorities and rival political groups
drag the country toward civil war.
In the north
Scotland narrowly defeated in 2014 in its independence referendum
declares itself an independent state as the authorities, anarchists
and nationalists wage war on each other for the sake of their own
agendas.
Wales distancing
itself from the violence in its neighbouring country also declares
itself a separate state under the authority of the Welsh assembly,
and as Britain breaks apart Northern Ireland descends into conflict
and violence as Protestant Unionists and Catholic Republicans battle
over the former British state and their religious values.
Ukraine’s
present could easily become the future of Britain if not any European
nation if we are not careful, but nothing will change the fact these
problems are already on Europe’s borders, three years ago it was
the Middle East rising up in anger but now it is much closer to home
and could easily spread to Europe in the future.
This is a double
edged sword that the leaders of Europe know fine well could swing
back at them, that is why they were willing to inure America’s
wrath when the refused to throw their weight behind the protestors,
they know fine what this could lead to in their own countries.
Like it or not
the issue of European membership has dragged the first country
European country to violence and possible disintegration, and it
leaves you wondering who will be next if the issues of democracy and
E.U membership go unanswered in our own countries.
KingCommo TO DrSigmundFraud
23 February 2014 8:46am
Well written.
It does look like a catalyst for
worsening outrage across Eurape, given the austerity etc there.
This could threaten to escalate, no
different to your 'forecasting', and Eurape does seem to be being
excessively hubristic, as if their global dominance is a given, and
everyone is duty bound to comply and submit.
Arrogance gone even madder than
arrogance is!
But, or so, my tuppence worth, is,
outrageous though it be, for Russia, China and the USA to step in, as
a block.
But, to go the full crazy, to all bring
to the global fore, the whole age-old, and totally failed issue of
'borders' and, 'nations'.
Their [borders] real reason and purpose
- 'economic exclusion zones' for the dynastic elites to manage their
own fiefdoms-once-empires.
War it's very likely to be, as you
assess.
But less likely if, IF, a majority of
the species gets up and brings the whole issue of nations and
borders, nationalism and patriotism etc., out into the public
arena/s, guided by [hopefully] more even hands of the named
superpowers, Russia, China and the USA, together.
The only probable FAIL in that is the
USA, what with it's utterly insane corporatism and its dumbing-down
of Americans, et al.
If any such chaos erupts in the US.,
with or after Eurape and the UK, etc., we can all kiss our sorry
asses goodnight, bunker down and wait for the radiation.
Yippee!
'Apocalypse' means 'cleansing', or
something!
Justice53
23 February 2014
1:03am
Recommend
16
This is John
Robles, you are listening to an interview with Professor Francis
Boyle. He is a Professor in International Law at the University of
Illinois College of Law
“It is a fact
that since 9-11-2001, the US Government has been in the business of
destroying countries and using NATO as it principle instrument. That
was stated more than a decade ago by then US Deputy Secretary of
Defense Paul Wolfowitz and later by General Wesley Clark.
The Pentagon drew
up a list of 7 states that were to be destroyed: Afghanistan, Iran,
Iraq, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and Syria and they have
systematically proceeded to destroy all of the countries on the list.
The strategy in
Ukraine is the same, US/NATO/EU are promoting the destabilization and
the breakup of Ukraine in order to achieve the NATO goal of moving
into Ukrainian territory closer to Russia.
While Russia was
distracted into believing that the US wanted a reset US foreign
policy was being planned and dictated by rabid Russia haters like
Zbignew Brzezinski and Richard Pipes. Brzezinski wants to breakup
Russia into approximately 68 parts and has placed his protégés in
key US foreign policy posts. According to Mr. Boyle Brezezinski has
staffed the Obama administration with his acolytes and protégées,
including the US Ambassador to Russia Michael McFaul, a specialist in
color revolutions. At the end of the day the US plan is to see the
breakup of the Russian Federation, that is the goal.
Since 9/11 2001,
as publicly admitted by then Deputy Secretary of Defense Paul
Wolfowitz, the United States Government would be getting into the
business of destroying states. And that was later confirmed by
General Wesley Clark, as you know in his memoirs, his meeting there
at the Pentagon where they had the list of seven states they were
going to proceed to take over.
Afghanistan was
first, Iraq was second, Sudan was on the list, Libya was on the list
and Syria was on the list, Iran was on the list. So, they are
proceeding systematically down that list of destroying states. Syria
is now near the top, Iran might be next. And it also appears now the
same strategy is being applied to Ukraine to promote the crackup of
Ukraine between east and west and, I would hate to say it, the
dissolution of Ukraine as a state.
Yes Wolfowitz
said… I have the citation in my book “The Criminality of Nuclear
Deterrence”, where Wolfowitz said: “We are going to get into the
business of destroying states”. And then, soon thereafter General
Wesley Clark (head of NATO) was in the Pentagon and can confirm they
drew up a list of seven states that they were systematically going to
go after.
So, that’s
really, the objective here of Syria, against Syria, is as they did to
Libya: to crackup Syria as a state into its constituent, religious
and ethnic units not only for the United States but also for the
benefit of Israel.
As you know,
Israel has been a long time opponent to Syria. They headed a plan
there, the Yi Nolan Plan to crackup surrounding states in order to
better manage them and keep them under control. So, here you see a
congruence of interests certainly between the United States and
Israel.
And I regret to
say it, but pretty much they have cracked up Syria in its constituent
units, as they had done to Iraq. We now have basically three mini
states in Iraq. The same has been done to Afghanistan and also Libya,
where you have, you know it is hard to say there is a meaningful
state there anymore. I have a new book out called “Destroying Libya
and World Order” where I have all these citations in there and an
analysis. And then, I tried to extend this to Syria near the end of
the book.”
http://www.globalresearch.ca/ukraines-brown-shirt-revolution-part-of-a-us-nato-eu-plan-to-break-up-russia/5370136
KingCommo
23 February 2014 8:58am
Well..., it looks from here, that the
world is rooted!
A rush on nuke-suits is expected at
Marks and Sparks, Walmart, Harrods, etc!
"Can you get them in wool?"
And one to an article written to The Guardian by Australia's ex-Prime Minister, then of the 'right-wing' LNP coalition. BUt he's 'mellowed' well, and is very Balanced in his politics and commentaries, so much so, that for years I've seen Mr Fraser to be more 'Socialist' than of any right wing persuasion.
140304 My Guardian Comment to M Fraser
Article
Good points Mr Fraser!
Glad someone can still think clearly!
Larger objectives, crazy ones included,
by superpowers, thus by absolutely-corrupted superpowers, rarely make
it to mass media.
Time someone, some True Statesmen, and
Women, had a serious chat, about those, your points.
Clearly, today's 'foreign ministers' of
the western alliance, are frighteningly under-educated in these
larger realities, and even in how to think, from the highest,
Impartial level, and their ego is leading them, thus, us, into a deep
pit/ditch/abyss.
It's almost as if, some 'other' forces
are at play, driving them on, to making really very very foolish
decisions.
Plans laid decades ago, cannot possibly
be of any currency in this massively quickly changing and moving
period.
Aaand...,
MORE..., me...;
I reckon the 'extremists now, are the
west. Eurape, Britain and the US.
Eurape and Britain ride their arrogance
everywhere, merely as if they are the 'born to be superior and rule
forever' correct ones on earth. ['Whiteguys? SHEEESH!]
And, in all of this, everyone should
keep at front of mind, that when we refer to 'Britain, Europe,
Russia, China, all majors, and most lessers', we generally refer to,
quite wrongly, though true, the elite, so far up them..... it's the
'1%', and damn the 99%.
But, the US, military and/or admin,
ideological and psychopathic, as 'absolute power' makes us, might
well have an agenda, far more far sighted than you me or the most of
the western 'foreign' egomaniacs- ER - 'ministers'..., can see, let
alone contemplate wisely, and deduce sound paths forward from.
The forces active in the US, Pentagon,
and admin, etc., [corporations not to be ignored, whether they should
be or not], egged forward by 'the lords of sick' Brit-Euros [the
ultimate beneficiaries of the corporate world - aka monarchism in
money], are running at the speed of today's economics - too fast -
and have [built and] jumped on a carousel spinning out of control.
So, they push push push their ways and
agendas through all diplomacy, all [not necessarily 'better' in this
epoch of change] more tempered, 'gentler' [more - Br-itish, ol'
chum!] trying to fastrack their successes of an ideal democratic
planet.
They want, by any means to shatter the
bullshit Brit-Euro colonialist monarchic empires forever, and, as
we're all wasted, culturally and in terms of the planet's overall
health, they go hard hoping for the final goal before the final bell.
'Winning' is not so much their
hope/dream/delusion at this late stage. Most serious, and well
informed high-ups in places like the US admin and the Pentagon hate
fucking HATE the monarchic ponses of the 'old world', and as the
world's on the brink, they reckon fuck 'em, lets go for it, and
either way, it'll be tough, broken and totalitarian, or heavily
militarist from now on, but it'll still be better than those pri-ggs,
riding us all into hell.
JUST
DEFIANCE
Brayakooloong
Gunai Indigenous Outlaw
Australia
All
Praise the Immortals!
All
Praise the Warriors who have fallen
Fighting
for a Just World!
from
the Travelling 4x4 Tent of
JUST
DEFIANCE
aka
General
Blue Meanee
Commander
Notorious
General
War Pig
Outlaw
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